Based on my previous post, I have envisioned the following exchange between Kate Harding and a commenter who respectfully disagrees:
Kate Harding: All men are Schroedinger's Rapists. [Meaning that all men should be viewed as rapists until they prove otherwise... um... yeah.]
Commenter: Kate, I've loved your blog since its inception, and I admire the things you've done for women. I must, however, respectfully disagree with the idea that all men are Schroedinger's Rapists. This is taking things a bit too far.
Kate Harding: I took from your post the fact that you disagree with what I have said. I would point you to the following Feminism 101 websites. Read those and then come back here and post when you "get it."
Commenter: Thanks, Kate, but I've been a feminist for almost three decades now, and I am the author of one of those Feminism 101 sites which you recommend. I still must respectfully disagree with what you've said about all men being Schroedinger's Rapists.
Kate Harding: You mean you still disagree? Read the fucking sites and don't post until you have.
Commenter: But... Kate, as I said, I authored one of the sites that you recommended. I know about feminism. I am a feminist. I simply disagree with what you've posted.
Kate Harding: You obviously don't get what feminism is all about, do you? All men are Schroedinger's Rapists. Anyone who doesn't get that, doesn't get feminism. Goodbye.
[Commenter is banned]
Or, the following scenario might better illustrate Kate Harding's pugnacious refusal to acknowledge any point of view but her own:
Children mill about at a party, eating cupcakes and speaking softly lest they disturb Kate Harding, the Birthday Girl. She cannot stand the quiet, so she yells, "Don't you like my birthday cake?" Another little girl whispers yes, followed by another, and another. One little girl says kindly, "It's pretty, but I don't really like green icing."
Kate has her bodily ejected from the birthday party.
Friday, October 9, 2009
Kate Harding and Her Clitorises
I've been keeping a baleful eye on Kate Harding's blog at http://kateharding.net/. I've noticed a pattern in the threads there. Kate or one of Her Minions* post. Comments ensue. People are banned, and banned often.
There are the usual trolls, whose asses are admirably kicked to the curb almost the instant they post -- one thing I admire steadfastly about Kate and Her Minions is their dedication to their blog. And, indeed, their blog is a work of [PC feminazi] art; tenderly cared for and fiercely protected from posters whom are called (and I'd wager money on this) "those people" by Harding and Her Minions.
But here's the part that pisses me off. Some of those who find themselves banned number not with the trolls, but are actually people who disagree, and very respectfully at that, with whatever it is that Kate or Her Minions have posted.
I post the following exchange as proof of what I claim (see the whole thread at http://kateharding.net/2009/10/05/would-it-kill-you-to-be-civil/#comments):
"2009 October 5
goldnsilver wrote:
Fourth rule: If you even fucking mention “free speech” with regard to my comments policy, you will be banned.
I didn’t mention free speech in regards to your comments or comments policy. Read your own rules. I mentioned political correctness in the context of literature, media and texts.
Tenth Rule: If you are tempted to begin an argument against something we’ve said here with, “God, stop being so PC!” just stop right there.
You’ve got me on that one. I personally hate political correctness, but if that’s one of the rules of your blog then I’ll respectfully leave it out of the discussion.
“However, I think this kind of criticism is going a step too far, when it’s clear that I was only trying to talk to you about how pretty you look in that dress. Would you prefer that I was never allowed to say anything nice about anyone ever, or only allowed to talk to other men? Maybe you want me put in a camp and castrated?”
For fuck sake, that’s childish exaggeration and you know it. Does this mean that you guys can never be criticised, because my criticism is obvi0usly one step away from me supporting rapists?"
Fillyjonk saucily tossed out the following reply:
"Oh my god, you are PRECIOUS! I love how I call you out on your slippery slope fallacy and you set up a new one twice as fast. I can’t wait until you contravene the policy one more time and I get to ban you."
[Author's note: Fillyjonk seems to derive much enjoyment from the act of banning people.]
goldnsilver responded a few comments later with:
"I guess that I just disagree with this. And I shouldn’t be banned for disagreeing."
[Author's note: goldnsilver does realize that s/he is on Shapely Prose, right?]
Finally, the frank discussion of being banned, as given by Sweet Machine:
"And I shouldn’t be banned for disagreeing.
Oh, I guess you missed Rule 7."
If you've got the inclination and nothing better to do, you can comb through new and old posts over at Shapely Prose, and you'll see that goldnsilver is nowhere near the first to respectfully disagree, then fall to the Ax That Bans. It raises the serious argument that Harding and Her Minions are busily knitting an environment in which they May Not Be Contradicted. Which is their right; it is their blog. But what it amounts to is that these women wind up massaging each other's egos as they simply prop up their own arguments without ever respectfully and logically addressing an argument which challenges what they've already decided to think. They call people out frequently for Confirmation Bias. Let not the confirmation bias escape you on your very own blog!
They advocate the following behaviour as perfectly acceptable for a woman to follow:
Man sitting a seat or two away from a woman on public transportation says, "Hi." Woman screams, "Why the fuck are you talking to me? Did I say 'hi' to you first?"
I ask you, reader, to reverse the genders in this exchange so that it goes as follows:
Woman sitting a seat or two away from a man on public transportation says, "Hi." Man screams, "Why the fuck are you talking to me? Did I say 'hi' to you first?"
I'd say, and with good reason, that the man in Scenario No. 2 comes across as not only paranoid, but perhaps violent and dangerous as well. Certainly angry and / or emotional overall. Not someone I'd want to be alone with. Ever.
Hence, the woman in Scenario No. 1 comes across very much the same way. You can argue that because of Rape Culture (see Shapely Prose for a one-sided but thorough discussion on this topic), the woman is justified in repelling the man's greeting. I contend, however, that flipping the fuck out and screaming at the man to "DESISTE!" is psychopathic. And rude.
If you want to be fucking rude, fine. Be rude. Just keep in mind that you're coming across as seriously fucked up to the people around you. I'd say, for example, that the man in Scenario No. 2 needs some counseling at the least. The last time I saw someone react that way in public, it was scary. Definitely not pretty.
By the way, I think that vaginas rock. If you say that on Shapely Prose, however, you'll be reprimanded (and banned) for objectifying women. Dude, vaginas rock. It's as simple as that. The power of Woman, and that of Man, is very strong, and should be respected. But no -- if you say something akin to that, you'll A) be accused of being a pervert, and banned; and B) dissed for saying anything remotely positive about men, and banned. They may even ban you again, just to make sure that you're... well, banned.
*I've decided to grant A Sarah, Fillyjonk, and Sweet Machine the status of Minions because they lack only the hand-stitched standard ("Pro Penis Decorum Est," perhaps?) to complete their Kate Harding Battle Regalia. Perhaps they are more deserving of the title Clitorises instead?
There are the usual trolls, whose asses are admirably kicked to the curb almost the instant they post -- one thing I admire steadfastly about Kate and Her Minions is their dedication to their blog. And, indeed, their blog is a work of [PC feminazi] art; tenderly cared for and fiercely protected from posters whom are called (and I'd wager money on this) "those people" by Harding and Her Minions.
But here's the part that pisses me off. Some of those who find themselves banned number not with the trolls, but are actually people who disagree, and very respectfully at that, with whatever it is that Kate or Her Minions have posted.
I post the following exchange as proof of what I claim (see the whole thread at http://kateharding.net/2009/10/05/would-it-kill-you-to-be-civil/#comments):
"2009 October 5
goldnsilver wrote:
Fourth rule: If you even fucking mention “free speech” with regard to my comments policy, you will be banned.
I didn’t mention free speech in regards to your comments or comments policy. Read your own rules. I mentioned political correctness in the context of literature, media and texts.
Tenth Rule: If you are tempted to begin an argument against something we’ve said here with, “God, stop being so PC!” just stop right there.
You’ve got me on that one. I personally hate political correctness, but if that’s one of the rules of your blog then I’ll respectfully leave it out of the discussion.
“However, I think this kind of criticism is going a step too far, when it’s clear that I was only trying to talk to you about how pretty you look in that dress. Would you prefer that I was never allowed to say anything nice about anyone ever, or only allowed to talk to other men? Maybe you want me put in a camp and castrated?”
For fuck sake, that’s childish exaggeration and you know it. Does this mean that you guys can never be criticised, because my criticism is obvi0usly one step away from me supporting rapists?"
Fillyjonk saucily tossed out the following reply:
"Oh my god, you are PRECIOUS! I love how I call you out on your slippery slope fallacy and you set up a new one twice as fast. I can’t wait until you contravene the policy one more time and I get to ban you."
[Author's note: Fillyjonk seems to derive much enjoyment from the act of banning people.]
goldnsilver responded a few comments later with:
"I guess that I just disagree with this. And I shouldn’t be banned for disagreeing."
[Author's note: goldnsilver does realize that s/he is on Shapely Prose, right?]
Finally, the frank discussion of being banned, as given by Sweet Machine:
"And I shouldn’t be banned for disagreeing.
Oh, I guess you missed Rule 7."
If you've got the inclination and nothing better to do, you can comb through new and old posts over at Shapely Prose, and you'll see that goldnsilver is nowhere near the first to respectfully disagree, then fall to the Ax That Bans. It raises the serious argument that Harding and Her Minions are busily knitting an environment in which they May Not Be Contradicted. Which is their right; it is their blog. But what it amounts to is that these women wind up massaging each other's egos as they simply prop up their own arguments without ever respectfully and logically addressing an argument which challenges what they've already decided to think. They call people out frequently for Confirmation Bias. Let not the confirmation bias escape you on your very own blog!
They advocate the following behaviour as perfectly acceptable for a woman to follow:
Man sitting a seat or two away from a woman on public transportation says, "Hi." Woman screams, "Why the fuck are you talking to me? Did I say 'hi' to you first?"
I ask you, reader, to reverse the genders in this exchange so that it goes as follows:
Woman sitting a seat or two away from a man on public transportation says, "Hi." Man screams, "Why the fuck are you talking to me? Did I say 'hi' to you first?"
I'd say, and with good reason, that the man in Scenario No. 2 comes across as not only paranoid, but perhaps violent and dangerous as well. Certainly angry and / or emotional overall. Not someone I'd want to be alone with. Ever.
Hence, the woman in Scenario No. 1 comes across very much the same way. You can argue that because of Rape Culture (see Shapely Prose for a one-sided but thorough discussion on this topic), the woman is justified in repelling the man's greeting. I contend, however, that flipping the fuck out and screaming at the man to "DESISTE!" is psychopathic. And rude.
If you want to be fucking rude, fine. Be rude. Just keep in mind that you're coming across as seriously fucked up to the people around you. I'd say, for example, that the man in Scenario No. 2 needs some counseling at the least. The last time I saw someone react that way in public, it was scary. Definitely not pretty.
By the way, I think that vaginas rock. If you say that on Shapely Prose, however, you'll be reprimanded (and banned) for objectifying women. Dude, vaginas rock. It's as simple as that. The power of Woman, and that of Man, is very strong, and should be respected. But no -- if you say something akin to that, you'll A) be accused of being a pervert, and banned; and B) dissed for saying anything remotely positive about men, and banned. They may even ban you again, just to make sure that you're... well, banned.
*I've decided to grant A Sarah, Fillyjonk, and Sweet Machine the status of Minions because they lack only the hand-stitched standard ("Pro Penis Decorum Est," perhaps?) to complete their Kate Harding Battle Regalia. Perhaps they are more deserving of the title Clitorises instead?
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